The Pyramid of Power Players - Epstein, Freemasons, The Mormon Church and More! (Derrick Broze on Shaun Attwood)

5, 4, 3, 2, 1, and we are live with Derek Bros. You may remember, uh, 2022 he was on the show talking about the Finders, Epstein. Extremely well researched in all of these subjects, fantastic power speaker. And since then he's got a mammoth multi-hour documentary out about the Pyramids of Power.

Yeah.

Uh, secret societies. We're going to be talking about this stuff: Epstein, Zorro Ranch, Freemasons, and some Mormon cult behavior. So huge thank you everyone for tuning in. Derek has got a ton of links in the description box. He's on all of the different socials. Buy Me a Coffee, Pyramid of Power link, Man of My Word link. Um, so please support his important work. And we are 4 years on. We've got many new subscribers now, Derek. Huge thank you for coming on. Perhaps let's tell our new subscribers a little bit about you before we do these deep dives.

Sure. Thanks again for having me back, Sean. I appreciate it. And congratulations on all the, the growth in your life in different ways. Um, yeah, so for those who don't know my work, I'm Derek Brose, originally from Houston, Texas, and I started to get involved in activism and independent media in 2010. And I've basically been doing everything I can for the last 16, going on 17 years to try to reach people. As you mentioned, Sean, that includes documentary work. So the 17-part documentary series The Pyramid of Power— I produced a documentary on Jeffrey Epstein back in 2018 called Bringing Down Jeffrey Epstein. I did a documentary on the Finders cult called Who Will Find What the Finders Hide, as well as other documentaries on 5G and 9/11 and other topics like that. Um, I also am an author, so most recently we turned the Pyramid of Power documentary series into a book that people can read as well if they prefer that. And you mentioned A Man of My Word. That's actually my recently released memoir detailing my journey from getting into, uh, drugs and being depressed as a young kid and suicide thoughts and, and eventually going to prison at 20 years old and turning my life around. That's kind of my story. And my website is The Conscious Resistance. That's where I post my podcast interviews, all the other types of works I do, trying to, you know, explore everything from spirituality and the paranormal to doing deep investigative work. Um, yeah, and I also host an annual event in Mexico called the People's Reset, which is a 5-day, uh, 5-day solutions-focused event where people can come together and learn about growing food, learn about homeschooling, learn about, uh, mental, physical, spiritual health. I do a lot of different projects, but it's all aimed at the same direction— trying to awaken and empower humanity.

Okay, great. And I have lost my channel twice, and we are under a lot of scrutiny. So we have to use code words for certain things. Did Sarah send you the code words?

I don't think I got the code words.

All right, so we say PDF file for, you know, we also say human transportation. Sure. And, and what Jeffrey allegedly did to himself, which says like self-unaliving. They're the main ones, really.

Okay.

All right, thank you, thank you. All right, so it sounds like that you were researching Epstein pretty early on then. What, what were— what got you into that, and what were the most striking revelations?

Yeah, I mean, I started researching Epstein back in 2016. Um, anybody who's kind of— maybe even as early as 2015, actually, I think, because when Trump first came on the scene, I wrote an article back then called Here's the One Question the Media Won't Ask Trump, and it was about his relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. And, uh, so I've, you know, I've been kind of aware of who he was, just hearing the general tale of, oh, here's this alleged billionaire connected to powerful people involved into some shady, sick things, you know, that usual tale. And it wasn't until about 2017 where I started to really look deeper into it, and I actually visited Jeffrey Epstein's, um, Palm Beach mansion. Obviously I didn't go inside or anything like that, but I visited it and recorded the beginning of my documentary. The opening scene is right outside his house because I just happened to be in that area doing some, some presentations. And from there, I just, you know, I figured like this, this story needs to be blown wide open, and that eventually did lead lead to the documentary Bringing Down Jeffrey Epstein, which I will say, you know, prior to his arrest, it— you know, I don't know where it's at these days, but it definitely started to reach some people. It got half a million views before my YouTube channel was, was eventually deleted and randomly given back to me about a year ago. Um, so yeah, so I was just on that tail from the beginning and knowing that there was powerful connections there— politicians, celebrities, everything that everybody knows today. But as you know, Sean, back in 2017, 2018, there were far less people who even knew the name Jeffrey Epstein. much less what he was connected to and what he was involved in. And unfortunately, despite that awareness having grown the last couple years, I think there's still a massive cover-up that is continuing to take place in terms of what we know was found in Jeffrey Epstein's mansion videotapes. There's, you know, there's clear records and references to DVDs and to cassettes and all sorts of things that were seen but allegedly not collected and potentially destroyed, or maybe sitting in a Mossad safe somewhere or something like that. So that was kind of my initial goal is just how do I get more people to even know who this guy is and start asking questions about all his relationships? And when I published my documentary, October 2018, I think it was, about a month after that is when the big mainstream reporting started to happen. And then of course the following year is when he was arrested and all the things we were told happened to him. So yeah, for me though, it's just been important to try to expose power as I do try to do in The Pyramid of Power. I think it's helpful to— it's, it's useful to help people understand the different relationships that exist out there and who's connected to whom, and from there try to understand the way the system works. And Epstein was one piece, but a powerful piece, an important piece of this larger puzzle. And I, I hope that people are starting to realize that too, that it wasn't even that Epstein was the top of the pyramid or anything, so to speak. It was that he was another cog in the machine but connected to a lot of other powerful people. And surely by this point Epstein has been replaced and um, people serving that same role are, you know, have taken his spot.

Well said. And since we last spoke then, you know, we saw Trump, Bongino, Bondi, the whole crew campaign on, we will release the Epstein files, we will support the survivors. And then once they got in power, they did the complete opposite. They supported the poster child for human transportation, Ghislaine Maxwell, She was rewarded with a soft prison puppy program, et cetera. Looks like the way for her early release has been paved. I mean, we've interviewed like over half a dozen survivors. Their heads are absolutely spinning with all of this. I mean, what, what do you make? Is it just a case if they say anything to get in power and then they just bow down to the vested interests and protect the donor class once they get in?

I believe so. I mean, my, my, in the time that we've spoken as well, like the last 5 years, a lot of my work is largely focused on the technocratic movement, exposing people like Peter Thiel and exposing some of that donor class you talk about, which obviously is related to, you know, Israel. And in case of Trump, uh, the Adelsons— first Sheldon Adelson and Miriam Adelson— to me it was perfectly obvious this was what was going to happen, you know. And during the 2024 election season in the US, even though I'm not fully living in the US anymore, a lot of my journalism of course is trying to expose, um, the corruption. And myself and some of my colleagues who were calling out these different relationships and connections, we are consistently being called blackpilled. Blackpilled. You guys are just negative. You're just doomers. You just don't want to accept that we're winning. Because, uh, the Trump, um, what I call the Trump deception was very powerful the second time because you took a lot of different people who were disenchanted, from the Bitcoin bros to the libertarians to the MAGA people to the former Democrats who got sick of everything they saw during COVID 1984, all these different coalition of people. And then of course the hardcore MAGA people who would follow Trump you know, to the ends of the earth, brought them together and told people— and of course people like RFK and Tulsi Gabbard— like, look, the former Democrats, they're joining with us, we have a movement, we're building this, and promised everybody the world, including Epstein files and so on and so forth, JFK files, and we're gonna do these different things. And I think 2 years into it, it's pretty clear that most of those things were outright lies. Um, and I, I just think that's how the system operates. And for me personally, I think the sooner people recognize that, that whether you're in the US and obviously the UK and elsewhere, politics, they, they differ country to country. But by and large, you have the controlling, you know, controlling parties and controlling apparatus. And people will come along, whether it's reform in the UK and elsewhere, who are—

or the—

in the US, there's talking of a third party. Maybe we need a new third party that's gonna, you know, take things back in 2028. I think this is wasted time, wasted energy. And again, I don't consider that to be a black pill, to be, uh, you know, negative. for us to just step up and be adults and admit this system is controlled. We're not gonna win through their system. And that's basically what I aim to show with The Pyramid of Power and do it in a way that is factual, that actually points to all the sources that I found and makes it, you know, like completely, I think, incontrovertible that the political system around the world has been controlled going back at least 200 to 300 generations, 200 to 300 years, and maybe generations before that. But for sure, we can say the last 200 to 300 years. And if you come to accept that fact, you have to reckon with the fact that also that they control the political system. And it never made sense to me how many people were questioning everything that Epstein was involved in and then realizing how high up this goes and how many powerful politicians and celebrities and academics and so on and so forth are involved. And then every time election season comes on, they think we're going to vote our way out of it. And, and maybe it's just because people don't want to let go of that. I have my ideas on what else we could try, but The point for me is that we have to at least contend with reality, and the reality is that these systems are highly controlled and they're designed that way. And so Trump, as far as I'm concerned, was always controlled as far back as 2015 and 2016. I think this has been a long con, long game, and, um, I'm just glad more people are starting to wake up to it because I do get the comments on my social media of people saying, I voted for Trump 3 times— 2016, 2020, and 2024— but now after everything I've seen, I'm, I'm regretting that, and I admit I was, you know, I was fooled. I have people coming back to me who used to attack me saying, hey, you were right. And I don't need the accolades, I don't need the pat on the back. Okay, now let's do something about it. Let's, let's stop playing the, the game, banging our head against the wall thinking we're going to get different results. Let's actually deal with reality. And so that was a big part of not only my research into Epstein but the, you know, the Pyramid of Power, is to show people how power actually operates.

So having researched this, then, you know, you, you were ahead of the game because you knew how deep Trump and Clinton were in with Epstein. And, and I think a lot of people didn't know. Uh, could you elaborate on how deep they were, please, their relationships?

Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, this, this is, I'm sure, one of the areas I'll get some pushback. But yeah, the facts are there that Epstein and Trump were friends going back to the 1990s. We know that for certain. I mean, this is in the well, well-documented article out there where Uh, Trump says that, you know, Epstein does like— seems to like the women on the younger side. And so some acknowledgment that he seemed to be aware of, um, of what Epstein was up to, or at least, you know, his preferences for young girls— for young women, I think, is the term Trump used. And they had, um, they had business relationships. Some of it was, of course, just running in the same New York circles. Um, and of course, the Clintons were a part of that as well. And so there's those documented facts. Now, that has been going on since the '90s. We get into the early 2000s, this is where some of the controversy starts, where the, the story that Trump is told is that he kicked Epstein out of Mar-a-Lago. And I've done a few investigations on that over the years, and I've tried to track this claim down to the original source. And there's a few sources for this. There's, um, James Patterson's Filthy Rich book. He makes a reference to it where he says that he actually interviewed some former employees of Mar-a-Lago, and that they confirmed that Trump had kicked Epstein out. And of course, there's the story that this is where Epstein may have been trying to recruit, um, Virginia Giuffre. And so there's— I think there is some truth to that. But at the same time, we also have clear evidence that the relationship between Trump and Epstein actually broke up and fell apart over a real estate deal. And that is also very highly documented.

That—

so To me, what that says is that Trump probably knew what Epstein was doing. Doesn't mean Trump was guilty of anything, but it seems like he was pretty aware of it. With, you know, there's of course the videos that have come out over the years of them hanging out at parties, and not just in passing as some of Trump supporters will try to say. The one that I'm sure you and your audience have seen where they're standing together at a party watching a bunch of girls dance and they're kind of like pointing them out like, oh, look at that one, look at that one. And there's so many other examples. There's pictures, of course you mentioned Maxwell. Maxwell with um, with Trump and his future wife and Epstein and all these deep connections. They knew each other well. In Epstein's black book, he had 16 different numbers for Trump, including Trump's personal— person— like, for all of his homes and for his personal assistants and, and his bodyguards and things like that. That was more than anybody else in the black book as far as 16 numbers go. So there's this really heavily documented relation— documented relationship that I don't think any honest person can actually deny. Again, that doesn't indicate that Trump was necessarily guilty of anything, but it definitely means that he knew him very well. And the other thing, um, I actually interviewed the attorney Bradley Edwards in 2017— this is, uh, 2018. This is the year before Epstein got arrested. And, uh, we— I went to one of the civil cases that Epstein was facing in Florida, and I interviewed Brad Edwards, who's been the lead attorney for the survivors, and I asked him about this, like, I asked him about this claim about Epstein and Trump kicking out, and he said he couldn't prove the story. He said he looked into it. So this is the lead attorney himself saying he could never find clear, clear evidence. He heard those rumors, but he couldn't find any hard documentation of that. And also in that interview, he does say that Trump was the first person to pick up the phone. He said, when I called him, he picked up the phone, he shared some information. So I'll give Trump credit for that. And what, what happens now is often Um, Trump supporters will take that clip from my interview, and this happens to me probably every week. Somebody will tag me and using my interview and try to use that to see, look, Trump is innocent. But there's a couple of points there I'd just like to make really briefly. For one, he— Brad Edwards says this was in 2007, so this is after Epstein had been arrested already. By this point, Epstein has been accused of all kinds of things, as we know. He's being investigated by the Palm Beach Police. It's starting to turn into a federal investigation. So it makes perfect sense to me that after the fact, somebody like Trump would then start jumping ship and say, hey, let me tell you everything I know about this guy. But prior to that, when he says he knew he liked them young, on the young side, he never went to the cops on his own. He never, you know, volunteered this information. It was only after the fact, after Epstein was arrested, which again, I mean, that's just— if, if you're— and if you know somebody's up to some shady things and they're busted and you want to turn them in, or you want to become a rat, however you want to think about it, yeah, here I got— I'll tell you everything I know. And so it doesn't surprise me that much that Brad Edwards says after Epstein was arrested, when he called Trump, Trump was willing to offer different information and he shared information. And Brad Edwards specifically says, and that information checked out.

Great.

Again, I don't think that absolves— it doesn't prove Trump was guilty either, but it doesn't absolve him of anything. If anything, it proves that he knew something and he didn't go to the authorities until he was later called by an attorney after Epstein was arrested. So all that to say, you know, my goal here isn't to try to you know, pin Trump on something. I think that there's, there's definitely, um, some signs pointing in that direction, let's say, after everything that you, you talked about a moment ago, them running on, we're going to release the Epstein files, we're going to put all these people on there, all this accountability, and everything that we've seen the last 2 years from the fake binder stuff to document dumps to documents being changed. We know that Pam Bondi was specifically asked to take out files related to Trump. I don't trust that we are actually getting the full complete files. And of course, because this is such a huge document dump, It could take years for people to actually get through it and find new details that might be relevant to a relationship with Trump and Epstein. And my last thing I'll just say here is that we're talking 20 years after the fact, right? So if there was some damning evidence, whether it was about Donald Trump or other very, very powerful people that are too big to take down, that information would not be in these files. That information would be long gone. It would be deleted. As I said earlier, half-jokingly, it would be sitting in a Mossad safe waiting to be used for blackmail. And that's the other thing is people say, well, if Trump was involved in something, they would be using it against him. But that's not how blackmail works. If you have something on somebody, you don't expose it. You hold it against them as long as you can, use that to threaten them and get them to comply, maybe to launch a war or maybe to do other things that you might want to do. And you say, hey, well, we are going to release this information. We'll dangle it over your head as long as we could. That's how blackmail works. Again, we don't have proof yet that that means Trump was involved. There have been accusations of Trump you know, committing crimes in these different ways. Those haven't been proven in a court of law, but I don't think if we're honest about it, it's that hard to, to really see how deeply ingrained Trump was with Maxwell, with Epstein, despite what he claims now about, I didn't know her very well. And then also you point out too, it seems like they're, they're going to be giving her a sweetheart deal just like Epstein originally got.

So we saw Bill Clinton getting asked about the jacuzzi photo and he's feigning senility going off on tangents about his wonderful charity work and his relationship with the Sultan of Brunei. What, what do you make of the Clintons' relationship? Because I believe, didn't Jeffrey visit the White House almost 2 dozen times?

Absolutely. I have no doubt that they're compromised in, in some way as well. I mean, so to me, this isn't a party thing of Trump versus Clintons. If they're all guilty, then let them all be exposed. And, and you're right, I mean, it's convenient for the Clintons now to Oh wait, I don't know anything. I don't, you know, I don't recall everything exactly. Um, and there's some interesting things. I'm sure you've covered this on your channel over the years, like the picture with, uh, uh, Clinton with the woman known as Rachel Chandler, and that whole kind of rabbit hole and thread, uh, for people who've looked down there. I mean, there's definitely some, some interesting things there. Like you said, the visits to the White House while he was in— like Epstein visiting the White House while Clinton is, is president. Something there, right? And of course, much of this does go back to the Clintons and the Trumps, etc., their relationship with the Israeli government, Ehud Barak, the intelligence networks, so much more there. And so I think this is— it's just a sign. Like, if somebody like Jeffrey Epstein could be infiltrating the White House, the highest levels of power in the United States, obviously Prince Andrew in the UK, and so on and so forth, we're talking about a high-level operation. And if it was an Israeli intelligence operation, or any other country— because I know the mainstream has tried to say it seems like Epstein worked for the Russians whatever it was, uh, they infiltrated the highest levels of government. They infiltrated the UK royalty. They infiltrated the, the White House under Clintons, and I would say now under Trump as well. And we don't have any hard evidence about the Bushes, but I wouldn't be surprised. We know that there are some, some different connections there via Maxwell, and of course her father and everything that he was involved in. So yeah, I, I definitely think the Clintons— again, do I have hard evidence that they did some form of abuse? I haven't seen that. Other people may feel differently. But do we have evidence that they absolutely knew Epstein and they had a deep relationship that they're now just trying to brush off as some sort of philanthropic connection? 100%. And Epstein and his own emails say that he was one of the founders of the Clinton Global Initiative. And so, I mean, there's, there's that information as well that they continue to try to downplay and ignore.

Yeah, and a guy who was instrumental In the visits to the White House was Mark Middleton, who was allegedly self-unalived. I put hashtag Clinton body count, I say. So Mark Middleton was an American businessman and lawyer, served as special assistant to Bill Clinton in the White House during the '90s. He facilitated visits to the White House, flew with Epstein during this time. And hey presto, he, uh, expires in 2022 in an alleged self-unalivement, found hanging by an electrical cord, uh, and had a shotgun wound to the chest. Uh, what did you find out about Mark Middleton?

Um, I haven't spent a lot of deep dive on that other than what you just shared there. I will point, and those who are interested, to my colleague Whitney Webb, who has done some deeper dives on Mark Middleton specifically and his relationship with the Clintons and what he may have known. Uh, but it, it seems pretty obvious. I mean, just from what you just described there, for those who haven't heard that, this is a common tactic, unfortunately. And, you know, in, uh, in The Pyramid of Power, there's a few different stories that I cover, one related to the Oklahoma City bombing, one related to this thing and that thing, where you start to see, uh, see this same pattern of people, you know, unaliving themselves allegedly, and, uh, doing it in ways that are not, um, are just frankly not possible. You know, with Mark Middleton, I mean, I think we should just be as blunt about that as possible. The story they're telling us is an obvious lie. Anybody with a couple of brain cells left should be able to tell that somebody would not be able to do that to themselves. And the fact that it happened in relation to the Clintons— yeah, I'm not, uh, I'm not somebody who wouldn't say that, that you could add that to the Clinton body count there. I mean, I think that's— it's definitely worth investigating. As far as I know, that was not brought up in the Clinton hearings, that, you know, they were, they were dragged in front of the, the U.S. Congress. Great, I guess you could call that progress. But as you know, they didn't really answer any substantial questions. Nothing was actually brought up. You know, I guess it makes some people feel good. Okay, the Clintons are being confronted, but is there going to be accountability? I highly doubt it. But these are the kind of questions that if you had a real court of law and a real legal system, real justice system, these are the sorts of things that actual investigators would be bringing to the Clintons and more importantly bringing to a court of law and trying to share evidence and say, where does it— what does this point to? What did they know and who covered it up? Because this, it's, it's just, it's just another sign of how, how much these people in power think that they can laugh at us in the face when they share these kind of stories and they expect us to just swallow it.

Yeah, I've just finished listening to Whitney Webb's, uh, One Nation Under Blackmail, 2 volumes. I've got the audiobooks. And viewers, we had Whitney Webb on many years ago. It was banned, the video, We made some slight edits to it and we have put it back up. So if you want to check that out, I think she mentions Mark Middleton. And she was also the one who raised, uh, Wexner's, uh, demonic— uh, is it pronounced Dybbuk? The demonic possession of Wexner.

Yeah, yeah. And that's— I mean, that's— so that's— you asked earlier about what was one of the things that started me down this rabbit hole. Wexner was one of the first pieces of that and continues to be something that I think is highly under— uh, under-investigated. And I mean, on that front, I will say there is a little progress. I don't have high hopes for anything to happen, but Wexner himself, you know, of course was recently deposed in the U.S. But even separately to that, I did an article a couple of months ago. Wexner is also being investigated as part of an abuse scandal at Ohio State University where there were— there was a coach that was, you know, harming some of the students, these young boys, these wrestlers, for decades. There's actually a documentary that came out last year about this. I encourage people to check that out. And, uh, Wexner was part— he was president of the School Board of Regents at the, the university, basically board at the time. And there's pretty clear evidence that Wexner knew this abuse was taking place from this coach and that he was also involved in the cover-up of that. So there's currently a lawsuit in Ohio right now. I haven't checked on it in about a month, but it's, it's been ongoing right now, and Wexner is probably going to be dragged in front of the courts to testify. Um, and then last year, September, it was whenever U.S. Rep. Tom Massie and Ro Khanna, they had their big press conference, the first big one in DC, with some of the survivors of Epstein. I flew out to DC for that press conference and I got to interview Massie really briefly and talk to some of the survivors. But during the press conference, I was the only person with all the major media, international media there, I was the only person to ask and bring up Wexner and ask if any of the victims knew anything about him, if he was related to any of their stories, and Fortunately, it didn't get much coverage, and Wexner's kind of allowed to continue on and, and basically hide in the shadows.

Yeah, make billions from his investments in AI. And one of the scariest stories we were told by the survivors was when we had Maria Farber on, and she described being trapped at the Wexner property after these things had happened. And she called the cops, and the cops said, oh, we're already there. where body— you know, they were protecting the property outside and there was nothing she could do. She just felt so trapped and isolated while these things were happening. Absolutely shocking. So we've got a viewer question has come in from Marie, wants to know what were the specifics that led to Epstein's arrest in 2019? Sure.

So, you know, one of the mainstream versions of the story is that the Miami Herald's reporting by Julie Brown, uh, is what led to that. Now, they had been investigating Epstein prior to that for a couple of years, um, really since the beginning, since the first initial arrest back in 2005, 2006, and then the sweetheart deal. Brad Edwards and some of the attorneys, they never fully dropped the case. They continued to investigate it. They continued to follow up the leads and to talk to the survivors. But it wasn't until years later, whenever actually there— it appeared like there was enough evidence to go after Epstein. I tend to believe this was actually part of the cover-up and that it wasn't coincidental that it happened under Trump's first administration, and it wasn't coincidental that William Barr was at the DOJ. Of course, William Barr, we know his father was related to getting Epstein his first gig, um, at the Dalton Middle School. So there's these different connections between William Barr and his family And it just so happens to be that during Trump's administration— now, the, the Trump supporters, they would try to spin this and say, well, of course this is Trump going after Epstein, this is proof that he, you know, was, was bringing down the bad guys. I think this was actually part of the cover-up operation because, of course, this is when we're told, you know, Epstein allegedly did things that I don't think anybody really buys. But it— so to me, that's not a coincidence that this happens during Trump's first administration. They announced the arrest, they take him in, and of course we all know where that went. Now I think that is, is related to the, as I said, the Barr's relationship, that going back to old intelligence networks. If you just finished One Nation Under Blackmail, then you've heard some of this. And for those who've read Whitney's work as well as some of my reporting, this is pretty heavily documented how far back this network that, that Epstein was a part of goes. And so I simply see this as just, you know, coincidental timing that Trump comes into office, they make the arrest, and, you know, Trump claims he doesn't know anything about Epstein, he doesn't know anything about Maxwell. And then, well, it ends the way it ends with what we're told happened with Epstein. And so I, I just think this was part of the cover-up operation. But the mainstream version is basically that Julie Brown's reporting went viral, gets attention, and the public demands the arrest. And so that then the DOJ has to act. But I think this was probably planned prior already.

So I wrote a book, Who Killed Epstein? Bill Clinton or Prince Andrew? Do you think I should have added Trump to that title?

Maybe so. I mean, I, I— we don't have that evidence yet, right? But I do think that there's good signs to point to him being at least involved in his network, whoever's really controlling Trump. Because ultimately, I do think that Trump is, is, uh— not to say he has no agency of his own, but I don't think he's, you know, the top of the pyramid, so to speak. He's just another player like the Clintons and like the other folks you mentioned. And so yeah, I would put him on the suspects list for sure.

So if the political class, then the clown show, is say at this level of the pyramid, then could you describe what— how it goes up, who's above them?

Yeah, absolutely. So this is one of the things that I really aim to uncover with The Pyramid of Power. And I don't know if we've mentioned this, but the website in case anybody wants to get the book or watch the series is thepyramidofpower.net. And my whole aim with this was to describe what you were just outlining there how on one level we have the political class, we've got the outward-facing, front-facing organizations and institutions which people see and believe, okay, it's my local politician or it's the president that are running things. But then, as you know, the deeper you get and the more you look at these layers, you start to see that there are people above and beyond that. And what I wanted to do with The Pyramid of Power is to take some of the best existing information and books that are already out there, combine it with my own original research, and condense it down as concise as possible make it bingeable for the Netflix generation. So if anybody is new to these topics or you're familiar, I invite you to, to just take a look at it and start from the beginning. I started very basic with the education system because that's one of the ways they indoctrinate us— the establishment media, big tech, so on and so forth— and progressively getting deeper. The banking class, of course, is above and beyond the political institutions. When you have institutions like the Bank of England or the Federal Reserve, central banks, the Bank of International Settlements, these banks that are not, you know, they're not elected by the people. They're, they're members, and they are actually more influential, more powerful, I would say, than politicians. Because when you have the power to inflate and deflate the currency, when you have the power to wipe out wealth overnight, you know, that gives you a lot of power over, over everybody, over the entire world. So you have that level of the banking class, but then you also have, as you've mentioned a couple times here, the secret societies. And I would say religions as part of that. I do think religions, institutionalized religions, are part of the control narrative as well. Not to say there isn't any need for spirituality— I tend to think there is— but I also see how these different religions, the Abrahamic religions and so on, are used to control, manipulate people. Because you'll have people who claim to be Christian or claim to be, uh, Jewish or whatever they may profess publicly, and then behind the scenes they're meeting at places like the Bohemian Grove and doing, you know, whatever, right? So there's that sort of thing where they use religion to dominate people spiritually, spiritually. And then also they're, they're involved in secret societies which go back hundreds of years. And then this is where things get a little bit more complex. As part of my final episode of the, the Pyramid of Power— so the majority of the episodes are 30 to 40 episodes because there's like 30 to 40 minutes, because like I said, I wanted to make them digestible. But the final episode ended up being about 2 and a half hours long, so we split it into 2 parts, Volume 1 and Volume 2, Chapter 17. And in this, this final episode, I interview everybody from David Icke to Catherine Austin Fitz, uh, Mark Passio, James Corbett, a lot of great researchers who've been doing this for, for decades now at this point. And I really tried to present all these different theories because, as you know, Sean, some people feel very strongly that it's this group— no, it's this group, it's got to be the Masons, no, it's the Jesuits, it's the Jewish influence— and everybody's got their theories. Or maybe it's, it's, it's some otherworldly thing, it's reptilians, or it's a, it's a consciousness thing. And then some people say there is no capstone, it's, it's just a roundtable of roundtables at the top. And others say it's an ideology at the top. And so I basically explored all of those ideas. I gave them their day in court and said, here's what people believe, here's what we can prove and, and disprove, and, you know, here are some of my thoughts. And I tend to think that there's probably some combination of all of the above, that absolutely, is there a huge Zionist influence in the world? 100%, very clearly. And many people are waking up to that. And you can also look to groups like the Freemasons and see how they influence the American Revolution, the French Revolution, the Mexican Revolution, and so on and so forth, and how they've influenced so many powerful geopolitical events over the last couple hundred years. And there is a huge Jesuit influence, you know, people in positions of power including Trump who go to Jesuit universities and who go to Jesuit schools and affiliated organizations. So I don't necessarily see that there is one group at the top. That's my perspective. I know others would have their, their views, but I think it's really a bit more complex that these groups come together. They don't always agree on everything, but they agree on things 99% out of 100. And one thing they agree on is how they want to dominate and control the world. So even when they have their differences of opinions, and they may occasionally be at war with each other— there's definitely some good historical evidence to show that the Masons and the Jesuits have had a historical war conflict against each other over the last 200 years. But even when those groups are opposed, when it comes down to it, they will choose aligning with each other over the people 100 times out of 100. And that's one of the reasons why I think that they're successful, is because while they have us, you know, the average people trying to understand this, debating who's controlled opposition and arguing about this theory and this thing and that thing and fighting over each other, they're very good at putting their differences aside in order to focus on their long-term multi-generational goals. Which in their own words are to create this, this so-called New World Order. And so, I mean, when you understand what these people, what these groups actually say— and I, I, to my credit, I'll say I went back 300 years. I started finding the oldest books I could find that reference, um, a Jewish plot to control the world, or a Jesuit plot to control the world, or a Mason plot to control the world. And I ordered as many of these books out as possible. Some of them are quite expensive because they're out of print And I wanted to find the original editions. And in my— in The Pyramid of Power, which by the way includes all of my references, all the scripts have every link to everything I refer to, and every episode ends with suggested reading and watching if people want to go further— these theories are not new. Since the 1700s, since the founding of the United States, people have been warning about the influence of the Freemasons and the influence of the Illuminati, the original Illuminati, and them spreading to the U.S. and elsewhere. George Washington's personal letters, which still exist and are digitized and you can find online, include him being warned by actually a Scottish priest, um, I think is, uh, Robinson, I can't remember his first name, who wrote, uh, a book about this whole thing. He sent his book to George Washington and was warning him, saying, I believe the Illuminati is trying to influence, infiltrate the Freemason lodges of the U.S. You should look out for this. They just caused this revolution in France, and so on and so forth. So these ideas and these debates we're having are not new. This, this concept has been with the United States since the founding, and definitely with the United Kingdom for hundreds of years, where people have been trying to suss out who is running the world. Because they could tell different people in power— presidents, prime ministers, and so forth— they get to that position of power where they believe, okay, I'm the top of the food chain. And then all of a sudden they realize, maybe not. Maybe there are moves I can't make. Maybe there are forces beyond my control that are actually influencing the world. And that's really what I think is important here. Now, that might not necessarily put food on your plate or pay your bills. But I do think it is important for us to understand how the world works, because back to what we talked about earlier, talking about the political system and talking about it being rigged— until we can really fathom the depths of this and how deep it really goes, I just think people are going to keep trying the same dead-end solutions over and over until we are willing to be honest and say, look, there are people running the world, evil people, and they're using their influence, their money, their organizations, the media, the education system and all the different pieces I describe in the Pyramid of Power to manipulate the minds and the spirits of the masses. And if we can be honest about that, then we can start to say, okay, well, what do we do about it? But until we're willing to actually acknowledge reality, I just think we're gonna, you know, we're gonna be hacking at the branches instead of the roots.

Well said, because I think a lot of people have murky, nebulous ideas about this, or others have like a specific theory, you know, the British royal family's behind everything, or the Rothschilds, or the Rockefellers. etc. But to try and distill down what you've just said, then you're saying that the most ancient, powerful, wealthy institutions in the world, in cahoots with the banking dynasties, uh, come together when it suits them for certain agendas. Is that correct?

100%. 100%. That the— each of these groups have their own objectives and their own, you know, aims. Like the political level, maybe people want fame, they want power, they want money, and, uh, they're willing to work with whoever it takes to get that done. And then you have the banking interests with their own, their own interests, their own goals and objectives. And so these groups will partner together for common interest, for mutual— mutually assured goals, but they also— they aren't necessarily all motivated by the same thing, right? I don't necessarily think that every politician, even at say Trump's level, is fully um, clued into what's going on and how deep this power goes. They may have some level of awareness that there's a power beyond me and above me, and there's limitations in what I can do. And of course, things like this happen. For example, we talked earlier with Middleton— people end up, you know, mysteriously dying, or people get, you know, attempted assassinations, etc. And I think those are all messages. It could be— it could be a message of saying, hey, we're letting you know to stay in line. to do what we say. We have— and of course, we're not privy to the conversations going on behind closed doors, but what we do see in front of the screens and, and in the public, I think, is often, as I'm sure you know, Sean, coded messages for what is really being communicated behind the scenes. And because this is how these people operate, they do operate in the occult, in the hidden, with symbols. And this is, this is how they continue their power. So they don't come out and say, hey, we're going to control these politicians to do this. The politicians have their goals, and some of them, if you've got an ego, or let's say you've been cheating on your wife, or you've got any kind of shady history, those things can be used against you. You can be blackmailed, as we saw with Epstein. And that is how you can control people. It doesn't necessarily always have to happen with physical violence. It can just be through manipulating somebody because they have a huge ego and because they can tell, hmm, we could, we could use that, we could use that ego to our ends. Or, hey, we see what this person is doing behind the scenes, we can use that and bend them to our will. So these groups are coming from different angles, different places. but they combine together to form, you know, some people call it the blob, some people call it the deep state. I do explore the origins of even that term, the deep state, and the pyramid of power to really understand what that means and what it comes from. I tend to think of— I think it's just most helpful to think of it as a pyramid because it does get more centralized the higher you go, you get up, and it gets more complex, the, you know, the deeper you go as well.

So would you say that the secret societies are used to cement these relationships and also to help people who want to climb up in the pyramid to do so and to compromise those people? Microphone.

Absolutely, absolutely. Yeah, this is, you know, this is the fraternities, right? The original, the original secret societies, the Masons, they're called brotherhoods, fraternities, because this is where they become— they get to rub elbows with other powerful people. And in the case of, uh, Skull and Bones at Yale, the Freemasons, the many other affiliated lodges and groups around the world, even older groups like the Knights Templar— people know that if they enter into these, these organizations, they become a part of a club and they become part of a brotherhood, and that that brotherhood looks out for each other. And this is something I saw time and time again as I was researching the Pyramid of Power, that those who are aligned, they're going to benefit from it. Now I know that there are some people who will see this and say, Derek, I'm a member of the Freemason Lodge number whatever, And, uh, I don't— all we do is meet up and we just talk. We're just, you know, doing charity work. We're not actually involved in some, some secret work. Well, it's because, of course, the Freemasons and other groups, they operate with degrees, and they have to, you know, they, they go in through one degree and they progress deeper and deeper up to the 32nd, 33rd, and above degree in the Freemasons. And so that is, you know, you're not going to know everything if you're just a, a club member that comes once a month and you do some good charity work. And that doesn't mean you're being shown all the levels of this. And these groups, they are— and one way I guess you could think of it is like a gang, in the sense that gangs are people who operate together and you do what you need to do to serve your brother, to help your brother. Now imagine if those gangs get involved in politics, those gangs get involved in banking, those gangs get involved in Hollywood, and so on and so forth. Then they will look out for each other before they would look out for any other person. They put their brotherhood above the Constitution, above the law, above decency, above morality, because that's how they operate, that they are committed to supporting each other over anything. And one interesting thing you might like to hear, Sean, is that when I was researching this and trying to answer the question, okay, well, is it the Masons, or is it the Jesuits, or is it the, you know, the Zionists, There are conspiracy theories, and I say, I say that term specifically because they're not proven, they're theories. There are conspiracy theories about each of these groups having secret rituals and secret oaths that they have taken and that people believe are 100% real. Now, there is definitely some historical documentation that the Jesuits have a secret oath. Uh, there's some, some great books. Um, the Moneta Secreta is one of them that goes back hundreds of years, and there's just different tales of people discovering this secret oath where the Jesuits claim with a knife at their, you know, at their chest that they will— they will— I, I can't even say everything here that they promised they would do in order to further their goals, but basically they say that they will put everything before, um, that they will put the Jesuits before anything else, and including if that means harming family, breaking the law, so on and so forth. And at the same time, there's also these claims about the, the Masons, that the Masons have secret oaths, and when you get to a high enough degree, there's a secret oath that basically says we're going to put each other forward before anything else. And this is why you see a lot of Masons in— I learned that there's dozens of Mexican presidents throughout Mexican history that were Freemasons. I learned, of course, the U.S. presidents that were Masons, that the annexation of the state of Hawaii in the U.S. was also essentially a Mason job. They're called the Committee of Safety, and half of the members were Freemasons. You start to see these same examples over and over. And then the same thing, of course, there Um, there are things about the, the Jewish, uh, population, the Protocols of Zion and others. But each of these groups, there are theories that they have secret oaths that exist behind the scenes where they promise to do all sorts of evil things and put their allegiances to each other before everything else. And, and I also have seen this in the Mormon Church and other areas. It seems to be a common thread that when people join these cults, these clubs, these fraternities, religions, whatever you want to say, that behind the scenes there seems to be some agreements that we will put the, the goals and the agenda of the club before anything else. And if that means you have to break the law, if that means you have to lie to your loved ones, you have to cheat, you have to steal, whatever, you do it because this is your oath to the club. And again, I don't know if we can prove if every one of those oaths are correct, but it does seem to be a common theme. And, and if you look around our world, it, it seems to be playing out in reality.

Yeah, let me just put this picture back up for the viewers. Viewers, can you tell me in the live chat who is in this picture and where are they located? Let me see if, if you can guess this. We will get into the more occult side of this in a minute. So if you've just joined us, there's over 1,000 people watching live right now. I'm here with Derek Brose. All of his links if you want to support his important work Are in the description box: his website, YouTube channel, etc. He's at the Conscious Resistance on YouTube, Instagram, the Pyramid of Power. And let me just have a quick look in the chat. Yeah, Reagan. Yeah, Nixon. Yeah, correct, Lavender Skies. It is Bohemian Grove. Yes, Faith. Bohemian Grove. Absolutely. It is a picture of Harvey Hancock standing and speaking to a group of Bohemian Grove club members. at the Owl's Nest camp off the Bohemian Grove over breakfast, July 23rd, 1967. In attendance: Preston Hotchkiss, California Governor Ronald Reagan, former U.S. Vice President Richard Nixon, Glenn Seaborg, Jack Sparks, Edwin Pawley, and some unidentified individuals. And that— this, this is how the networking goes down. Okay, so, uh, you've expertly just, you know, just described what's above the political clown show. And we've had many guests come on and, and they talk about horrific ritualistic occult practices that are engaged in, and theories, for example, that, you know, when they've got all the money and the power in the world The next thing is absorbing the terrified, terrified energy of children who are about to be unalived, as one example. Uh, when you look into this horrific aspect of what these people get up to, Derek, is a lot of this hype, or do you believe they really do go and engage in these ancient practices, you know, going back thousands of years? We saw kids unalived for the purpose of the crops, sacrifices to the gods, stuff like that. Does that still go on to this day, do you think?

So this one is an interesting piece of the puzzle. First, real quick on the Bohemian Grove, um, mentioned there, which I— that's— that picture is, is really emblematic of how power operates and, and where it comes from all directions. And there's been several presidents who've been chosen at Bohemian Grove. And, uh, you know, of course the Bohemian Grove is where they do the cremation of care ritual, where they bring out an effigy of of a baby and they burn it in front of this giant owl. And according to them, according to the documents that have been released from the Grove, that this is all based on neo-Druidic practices, uh, is what they claim. And I will say on that as well, in The Pyramid of Power, I include some of the most recent leaked videos. A lot of people know some of the old school videos that came out from Alex Jones in the, the late '90s, but there's actually been some much more recent videos, high definition videos, color videos, not the kind of old shaky grainy stuff that Alex Jones have, but very clearly showing these rituals. And they're marching through the forest in red and white hoods. You can sort of see it there. And this was actually obtained by a kind of a random YouTube channel. He goes by the name Dancer, just @Dancer on YouTube. And he was—

Oh, we've had him on. We've had him on.

Yeah, yeah, you know Dancer. Yeah, so he does some interesting work. So he went back again this year and they've got even more footage of, of this. And so I just want to point that out for those who hadn't seen that, that there's some pretty clear footage. If you've never seen, um, you know, seen it in color, live in color, it's pretty fascinating to see that this is still happening. Now, in terms of the other aspect you mentioned about, um, sort of harvesting the energy of the children and things like that, or whether or not this— these rituals go back, you know, are related to the ancient rituals, I don't know that anybody That I've seen can 100% prove that. And for me, it's important because I do consider myself an independent investigative journalist to stick to the facts where I can and to make it clear when I speculate. And as I research the Pyramid of Power, and specifically the last episode, and trying to— you know, people claim it's, well, this goes back to the original Knights Templar, it goes back to mystery religions and the, you know, the different mystery cults in ancient Egypt and things like that.

Yeah.

What I see is 2 things. I see that there are documented examples of these Mithraic cults, of these ancient mystery cults, and, uh, Pythagorean— there's all these different secret societies. Those are real, 100%. There's def— there's, there's, uh, definite evidence of that. And then there's evidence of the Knights Templar and the Rosicrucians, and then there's evidence of the modern groups. What I don't see— and so I see some of the comments— the Canaanites, right? Everybody's got their theory of where it comes from. It goes back to the Bible. I don't think anybody anybody that I've seen can prove an unbroken lineage that goes back thousands and thousands of years and you can trace it. Okay, so then this group picked it up and this group picked it up and this, and all the way to today. What I do see is that these groups seem to be inspired and they may be sort of a spiritual successor, you could say, of those old groups, but I don't see any clear 100%, you know, proven without a shadow of a doubt evidence that this is an unbroken chain. From, you know, 2,000, 3,000, 5,000 years ago, however far back you want to go. Again, lots of theories out there, lots of books and documentaries making these claims. I tried to dig as deep into all them, and I didn't find anything that was satisfactory for me to say these are the same groups that were doing ancient rituals back in the day, and they've survived unbroken to today. With that said, I absolutely do believe that these modern groups are doing similar rituals and maybe taking inspiration. And absolutely, some of the work I've done on the Finders, as well as this Utah ritual abuse scandal I've been investigating the last few years— that's part of chapter 15 of The Pyramid of Power— absolutely, these victims and these alleged victims talk about this. They talk about witnessing abuse and, and, you know, just horrific things, and also talk about the people, the abusers specifically saying that they were doing this for Lucifer or doing it for some other sort of entities and things like that. Again, can— do I— I don't have video evidence of them doing this, but I think there's pretty good documented evidence of that happening to this day. I'm just less, you know, I'm more skeptical that it's an unbroken chain from, you know, these ancient groups.

So looking at some of the modern-day horrors then, as opposed to the ancient rituals, in the Epstein Files, you know, you've got Epstein talking to— I think it was a molecular biologist— about the generation of hermaphrodite babies in a lab in Ukraine. And they were joking around about the deviant purposes they could use these hermaphrodite babies for. And then you've got all of the allegations surrounding Zorro Ranch. We've had multiple survivors come on this very channel and talk about waking up in Zorro Ranch. They they believed that the, uh, internal organs had been tampered with or, or eggs extracted. Money was offered, uh, for babies. It seems to be a recurring theme. They were trying to get their hands on babies and they were trying to genetically engineer babies. Uh, what do you make of this? And do you think there's been one huge cover-up at Zorro Ranch?

Oh, absolutely. I mean, Zorro Ranch is one of the, the most Underinvestigated, overlooked areas of the whole Epstein saga. That I would say, as well as France and Jean-Luc Brunel and everything that got covered up over there. I have seen that recently there have been calls to investigate Zorro Ranch, and of course the new owners of it that, you know, claim to be Christian and they're turning it into like a Christian camp and all sorts of things that make me very skeptical of what is going on and if it ever stopped. Um, I think the Zorro Ranch part is, is absolutely overlooked. You mentioned Maria Farmer. There's others who've discussed this, and of course former New Mexico Governor Bill Richardson and, and connections he had with Epstein. I think it's highly likely that whatever was going on during Epstein's time, of course, was covered up. Evidence was destroyed, moved away. And I do think there's potential that it's still happening. I mean, we know that there are discussions about underground tunnels related to the island But I've seen some evidence related to that, and people talk about tunnels in New Mexico as well. And the location, if you look at where it's at in New Mexico, it's fairly isolated. It's a sprawling complex. It would not be that difficult to, to hide things out there, even in our day and age where people have drones and they try to fly over these, these cases, as people did with the island. Um, I don't think we're getting to the bottom of that. I think that's just an ongoing cover-up. The fact that, that this nearly— what is it, 20 years after Epstein's original arrest, and there hasn't been a real investigation of it. The fact that it took decades for them to even go look at it, the fact that it took public outcry— I mean, whatever was really going on there, I'm, I'm sad to say that I don't think we'll ever fully know. But what we do know is disturbing enough, and people should have been held accountable.

So who owns it now, and why aren't they allowing, you know, any, any investigation? Over the—

well, there has been— last I, I read about this, there was a, um, I want to say the Attorney General in New Mexico had announced that they were going to do some investigation. Uh, back in February, I saw reports where they were talking about they were going to start looking into it. The new owner— just to point up the name right now— the new owner who is claiming again it's like a Christian camp, Don Huffines, that's his name. Excuse me. And he is a MAGA Republican, so he's kind of connected to Trump as well. And they said they're going to turn it into a Christian retreat. They've been excavating the building, demolishing it since earlier this year, destroying. So that's the other part of it. That could— the whole thing could be part of the cover-up, is somebody related to Trump or connected to the Epstein operation buys it, they destroy the evidence, they rebuild it on top of it and, and get rid of whatever evidence may be remaining. Now, since that time, since these early— the reports I saw early in the year, I don't believe there has been any action. I haven't checked on it in about a week or more, so I— there may have been a new announcement, but last I saw, the claims of investigating and the claims of looking further into it haven't gone anywhere. There are still survivors trying to speak about this and saying, look, I was trafficked to New Mexico, there are people who need to be held accountable there. Because the other thing is, there's so many pieces of this puzzle. We like to focus on Epstein and Maxwell, but then there's also, of course, the banks that help them launder the money. There's all the employees who are working with Epstein, some of whom were victims originally and then ended up kind of helping out with the operation. Uh, there's, there's pilots, there's all different people who had to have known something and had to have seen something, and other people who talked about being trafficked to New Mexico. At the moment, I don't think there's anything new that's coming out of it other than that retreat I just mentioned, that they're building this retreat. And yeah, we'll see where it goes because it would kind of be ironic, sad, disturbing to see this whole thing be turned into a Christian retreat for young kids. I mean, maybe that's a way— if it is what they say it is, maybe that would be a positive thing. But I think many people, myself included, would be very skeptical to blindly believe that it's just going to transform to some magical place, especially when there's never a real investigation and there's no accountability.

And you're talking about banks that should be held accountable. So what do you think about the roles of Leon Black and Jess Staley?

Jess Staley is, is a big part of this, and he has been facing investigations over the last year, and I think he's be— I mean, he should be in prison as far as I'm concerned. And he's lied numerous times. This is coming out in the court records from like almost everybody associated with Epstein claiming they originally— they didn't know anything, they didn't have access to any information, they didn't see it. That's become clear that he's lied. And not only him, but other officials, other people connected to the Obama presidency, uh, including Obama's former attorney, who've all been proven now that they were lying about it. Now, Jess Daly, I don't think he's going to put in prison, unfortunately. I think he's gonna face some fines. I think the last time, that's basically what it was, is he, he was going to lose his position and, um, you know, say, say I'm sorry, things like that. But he's not going to go to prison. The last thing I saw just in the last week, actually, here's a headline: Jess Staley tells House Oversight Committee he spoke with JP Morgan CEO about Epstein's crime. So he's still being called in front of the U.S. Congress. This is still being investigated. But will he go to prison for knowingly doing business with somebody who is obviously involved in some horrific things? I highly doubt it. I mean, this just kind of goes back to my bigger point about the pyramid of power, that I don't think real accountability is going to come through the political system. And I don't say that to be, to be negative or to be blackpilling. I just think it's a reality we have to deal with, that these people are above the law. And just one other point on that, that I, I do think part of this is kind of being done on purpose in terms of the last 2 years. Epstein and, and in general conspiracies have gone mainstream, Sean. I'm sure you've seen this over the last 5 years. This is like the biggest podcast in the world. Not that I necessarily trust those people at the biggest podcasts of the world, but they're talking about conspiracies like 9/11 and things that you used to not be able to talk about. I believe that this, in addition to Epstein and everything else we're seeing sort of flooding the mainstream and flooding the zone, is also part of a kind of psychological operation designed to instill learned helplessness within the population. Basically to say, here's all the facts, here's all the truth, and guess what? Nobody's going to jail. Nobody's going to be held accountable. And what are you going to do about it? And so it sort of sends that message to the population that, well, why should we even bother? Why should we even investigate? I mean, just think about how the, the idea, which I think is true on some level, but it's you know, people believe whatever they want, that, that PDFs are in charge of everything and PDFs run the government. That's just a normal statement people make now, not even in conspiracy circles, not in the circles we run. I see this just with normie regular folk out there who will just say that sort of thing, like, well, we all know PDFs are in charge and PDFs are eating children and whatever else they might say. That is just kind of accepted by the population. But does anything change? Does anything happen? No, people go about They go grocery shopping, they take their kids to school, they just continue to go about their lives, and it just sort of becomes this accepted thing. I believe that is probably done on purpose so that the message is seeded into our minds: you cannot stop us, nothing will stop this from happening, you might as well just not even try.

So you've got a question from Katie then, uh, Derek. How many more islands and retreats do you believe are currently operating worldwide?

Yeah, I mean, Epstein's Island is obviously still there, and, and there are other islands. There's other billionaires who are buying islands for who knows what purposes. It could be nothing, could just be they're wealthy and they want a private island, right? That's— I'm sure that's a dream of a lot of people who don't have evil intent. But, um, I would doubt that there's more places in the world that these, these folks have gone. In fact, if anything, the more exposure they get, the more remote they go.

Yeah, look at Nygaard as well. We interviewed his son. So we, we have touched on the Mormon Church, uh, with, with Kevin and Annette, and I've watched a documentary, uh, about some Mormon offshoot recently on Netflix. But you've been looking at the Mormons as well, haven't you, Derek?

Absolutely. And this is, uh, thank you so much, Sean, for giving me a chance to talk about this, because this is, uh, I think a really important piece of the puzzle, and I'm glad to hear you've talked to others about Um, I— so first I'll just give a little background. In 2022, I started to investigate this case in Utah, the state of U.S., uh, where the Utah County Sheriffs had announced in May 2022 that they were— this was their own words— that they were investigating ritualized child abuse. And that was exactly the way they described it, ritualistic child abuse. And they said, we're investigating this We're looking for anybody who has information related to this abuse taking place in 3 different Utah counties between the 1990s and 2010. Of course, when that headline comes out, that's kind of like, whoa, actually there's, you know, somebody's actually gonna investigate this? I thought we were all told it's conspiracy theory. So I immediately started following that story and looking into what the whole thing was about. I started reaching out to the sheriff's department trying to get as much information, and between 2022 to pretty much today I've been following that story, and so there's sort of 2 threads that I'm gonna lay out here. And I know this can be a little in the weeds, but I'm gonna do my best to just make it as simple for everybody. So the sheriff's investigation announces that— they announced the investigation, and then they claim they're looking into abuse related to some unnamed man. We don't know his name, but a couple months later they arrest him. His name was David Hamblin, and he was accused— he was a former therapist who'd been accused of of, uh, abusing his own daughters and admitted in recording that he did abuse his daughter. He says, I'm so sorry I did this to you. And he's arrested. He's the first arrest. Then his ex-wife Roselle Stevenson is also arrested. This is about 2020— 2024, I want to say. And for the next 2 years or so, he's on an ankle monitor. He's going to court cases. More victims start speaking up and saying, look, I have information about this. And, uh, unfortunately, long story short, on David Hamblin's story, he is let go in 2025. The case is shut down, dismissed without prejudice. And the interesting thing about that is this is the second time that David Hamblin in a decade has been accused of, of this stuff. So he got 2024 arrest and then let go in 2025. But back in 2012, he was also arrested by Utah authorities for the same, same claims, same accusations. But in both times, in 2012 and in the 2020s, when he is arrested and the case begins All of a sudden it becomes very difficult for the courts to get him into trial. Evidence is difficult to find. People describe it as, you know, foot dragging taking place. And so in 2012, when he's first arrested, victims come forward, including his own daughters, and they provide detailed, detailed, detailed statements. I mean, some of the most horrific things you've ever read, Sean. Like, I'm talking hundreds of pages. One victim statement is literally 150 pages long, describing over 50 incidents of alleged abuse. And this is not just like, oh, one day in May 2010 he came to my house and did something. This is like detailed names of people, places, locations, and very difficult to dismiss. You know, you would imagine this at the time— they're grown adults now, but at the time they were young women, young girls, and they're describing very, very detailed stuff. So that's from the first 2012 case, again dismissed in 2014. A decade later, David Hamlin's arrested. dismissed again. Now, so that's David Hamblin. He is unfortunately walking the streets free today in Utah, and he, he's still accused of things, but the case was dismissed without prejudice, so it can never be brought back. Now it's, it's basically he's, he got— he's getting away with whatever he's been accused of. But when the original investigation was announced by the sheriff's office, the very next day, a local powerful politician named David Levitt— at the time he was the Utah County Attorney— he comes from the Levitt family, The Levitts go back to the early days of the Mormon Church. His brother was former governor of Utah. His father's name is Dixie Levitt. They run one of the biggest insurance brokerage companies in the United States, uh, the Levitt Group. And so the day after the sheriffs announced their investigation, David Levitt out of nowhere holds his own press conference. Nobody has been named, no suspects have been named. They just announced they're investigating ritualistic abuse of children. David Levitt holds a press conference, he gets all the local news And he says this investigation is an attempt to attack me politically because he was running for reelection at the time. And he said that, you know, they're trying to get rid of me. This is all— it's all garbage. Nobody had mentioned his name. He also said me and my wife are not cannibals, we're not murderers, we are not abusers. And everybody's looking around like, nobody said you were. Where is this coming from, right? And then he provides the 151-page victim statement that I mentioned from 2012 He provides it to the press and says, there's false allegations in here about me and my wife, and he— I believe the sheriffs are, are going to use this information to try to destroy my career. Again, at that point, nobody even knew what the heck he was talking about. It was just like, wow, a county attorney just gave a press conference saying I'm not a cannibal, I'm not an abuser, I'm not a murderer. So when that happened, I'm following this story just live as it's happening, and there's this back and forth with the sheriff and David Levitt it. In the end, David Levitt does lose his election. He, he loses his position as Utah County Attorney, and he blames misinformation for it happening. And shortly after that, he moves to Scotland. He moves out of Utah, moves to Scotland. Now, as I mentioned a couple moments ago, the, the county sheriffs, they continue their investigation. They eventually arrest David Hamblin, the therapist. He gets arrested, but then the charges get dismissed. As this case is going on, more and more evidence starts to come out pointing in the direction of David Levitt, the Utah County attorney. In that 151-page victim statement, these victims describe that David Levitt and his wife, uh, Shalom Levitt, that they were involved in the abuse. Because what they describe is that there is basically a cult within the Church of Mormon that is involved in what they describe as satanic Luciferian abuse that includes very powerful members, including David Levitt, David Hamblin, and others. They named several people's names, and these are real people existing in Utah. Uh, they haven't been proven in court of law, so I'm not going to name them. But these detailed documents describe that David Levitt and his wife are a part of this, this abuse cult. And so David Levitt is just like, it's all garbage, that's just a mentally ill woman, um, making up things, which is completely false. And so as I start to dig into this, more information starts to come out. We start to find out that not only was David Levitt under investigation for these claims by the federal government of the United States, but also he was under investigation for an illegal adoption of a Native American girl. And this, this story is also kind of convoluted, so I won't get too much into the details other than to say that David Levitt used his connections and his, his influence to adopt this Native girl, take her from her family even though her grandmother wanted to keep her, her, her father wanted to keep her, her uncle wanted to keep her. Her mom did have drug problems, and unfortunately David Levitt convinced her to sign over her rights, but the rest of the family was willing to take her. And there's a law in the United States called the Indian Welfare Act, which is, um, Indian Child Welfare Act, which means that Indian children, Native children, are supposed to stay with their families when possible. David Levitt went to the chief of the tribe that this young girl was from and said, hey, I have contacts in Ukraine. What if I help you sell your buffalo to Ukraine and then you help me adopt this girl? Basically just as a quid pro quo. Completely illegal adoption, and he admits to this. There's a recording of him admitting to doing this, and, um, and then he basically is allowed to adopt this girl in 2017. And as I said, after he loses election, he moves to Scotland. This young girl is now 9 years old. She's been in the possession of David Levitt and his wife for the last 8 years, and her family is still fighting to try to get her back. About a month ago, I spoke to an investigator, an analyst with Homeland Security Investigations, which is part of the federal government in the U.S. He does not want to be named publicly, uh, but he is a whistleblower who had his, his career destroyed. And, and people can find this article. I write articles for thelastamericanvagabond.com, and my most recent investigation is about this whole thing, about how David Levitt moved to Scotland, took this native girl, and he bought Knockderry Castle in Scotland, him and his wife. And now if you go to @knockderrycastle on Instagram, they have 1.4 million followers and they've remade themselves as Instagram influencers remodeling a castle. Nobody has any idea that they were under investigation. This analyst told me that not only were they under investigation for the adoption, that they were under investigation for the ritual abuse claims. He said they were being taken very seriously behind the scenes. And, uh, basically, as they started to, to do their investigation, the analyst said that his partner, special agent, got the idea to to file a subpoena to get access to the Mormon Church's sexual abuse hotline. So for those who don't know, they have— the church has a 1-800 hotline because abuse has become so rampant. They basically say, if you believe you've been abused, call this 1-800 hotline, we'll provide resources. Most people believe this is the way that they cover up the cases, that once people call that, they convince them not to report it. They might pay them off and things like that. So the analyst and his partner said, we're going to file a subpoena. We're going to get access to all the records from the hotline. and maybe we'll find more information from our victims or from our alleged suspects. And they said that as soon as they tried to do that, their supervisors and the special agent in charge above them— in his words, he said, you know, they lost, they lost their minds basically, and they, they lost it, and all hell broke loose. And at that point, the special agent is shipped to a different city. The analyst is basically told repeatedly, like, there's no evidence here, there's nothing to go, go into. And he described to me a scene where he's literally coming into the office his boss is sitting down at a desk. There's another supervisor standing next to him. There's a stack of papers of all the evidence they've been gathering that he said they won't even look at. And he's just pleading with them and saying like, why are we not investigating this? This guy's admitting on record to illegally adopting this girl. We have all these victim statements accusing him of other things. Why is— why are we not investigating this? And the supervisor just kind of sitting at his desk with his arms crossed, and he's like, I don't know, I really can't think about it. And he looks at the other guy and says, you have any idea why we're not investigating? Just totally mocking him and sort of making it clear like this isn't going anywhere. But he continued to push it, and eventually he was, you know, driven out of there. He decided to file a whistleblower complaint to try to go above them and saying, look, we've got evidence, this is being ignored. And they spent $2 million trying to destroy his career. He says they went through his iCloud, they went through his phone, tried to find anything illegal they could on him. They couldn't, but they did destroy his career. So now he's kind of, you know, decided to go a little bit into the shadows. But he, he confirmed to me 100%, like, this case was covered up. They had, they had good evidence that David Hamblin— David Levitt's adoption of the native girl was illegal and would basically be considered child trafficking. They had good evidence that David Levitt was linked to this alleged cult within the Mormon Church, but that was being covered up. And yeah, and his career is destroyed. And now, as I said, David Levitt, David Levitt and his wife, they, they run the accounts at Knockderry Castle on Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, everywhere else. They've got 2 million plus followers across all the platforms, and I've been just trying to do what I can. This is one of the reasons I'm so grateful for you to have me on, Sean, because I don't think enough people in the UK and in Scotland even know this story. If they— some of you out there listening to this might be following them and just thought, oh, this is wonderful, look at these people rebuilding this castle, I want to follow their adventure, and have no idea what they've been accused of. And so I've been trying to do whatever I can to not only spread this story but to get any independent media in Scotland and the UK in general to ask them questions. Go to their accounts, and I'm not saying be rude, don't attack anybody, but just ask them what happened with that investigation in the U.S., what happened with this native girl adoption.

And they—

we've been doing this now for weeks. They've been blocking people. They blocked me. Um, they're definitely trying to hide from this. And the last thing I'll say on this, I don't think this is coincidental, but about 2 weeks ago, the Sunday Times published an article about them and said that they are being attacked by trolls on the internet. I think they're on the offensive and they're trying to kind of put out puff pieces. They did another one in Utah recently. Oh, how David Levitt retired and went and bought a castle in Scotland. They're definitely using their media contacts and their influence to try to beat back any questions. And unfortunately, with a million followers, you know, they can kind of shout down people like myself who have much less of a reach. But I'm hoping everybody hearing this will go to @KnockderryCastle on Instagram and elsewhere where you might follow them and just ask ask questions like that. You don't have to be rude. You don't have to threaten violence. I don't advocate for any of that, but just ask them what happened with the investigation into the Native girl. What happened to the investigation about ritual abuse? And, um, and just try to put pressure on them because unfortunately they're able to just go out there and live their lives. And I'm speaking with the family of this Native girl. They're still actively trying to get her back and, and they're losing hope every day, but they're, they're doing their best not to give up.

Wow, what a dark story, uh, to end this on. And one of our hosts, Ron, is up in Scotland. I'm sure he would be extremely interested to hear what you've just said, Derek. Huge thank you for coming on. And, and viewers, we've got almost 1,500 watching across all the platforms. Please support Derek at all of his links in the description box on YouTube. Is there anything you'd like to say in conclusion, my friend, before we sign off?

Sean, thank you so much for having me on. I'll just mention, if people want to learn more about the Pyramid of Power, if you want to watch the series or get the book version thepyramidofpower.net. My investigation into the Utah scandal is at thelastamericanvagabond.com. You can find my author page there. And since we mentioned my book earlier, if you want to learn more about my personal story overcoming drug addiction in prison and things like that, it's at amanofmyword.com. So thank you so much for having me on, brother.

Huge thank you for coming on, man. Uh, is there anything we can ever do for you, you let us know. I'm gonna go and close the show. You take care, my friend. Keep up the great research.

Thank you so much.

Cheers.